Shadowgate Forum Index Shadowgate
You can't fudge your dice rolls here...
 
 FAQFAQ   SearchSearch   MemberlistMemberlist   UsergroupsUsergroups   RegisterRegister 
 ProfileProfile   Log in to check your private messagesLog in to check your private messages   Log inLog in 

Shadowgate's RP Theme
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
 
Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Shadowgate Forum Index -> General discussion
View previous topic :: View next topic  
Author Message
Micca



Joined: 18 Nov 2016
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 4:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I say plug pull and be done with it..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ketamishadowmaul
Site Admin


Joined: 06 Mar 2017
Posts: 32
Location: Philadelphia, PA

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 5:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Kas, I know that this game doesn't have to be super dark to be enjoyable. (I had a lot of fun with "less dark but high stakes plots"). That being said I think the issue is sort of a choice thing. I think it would be great to have a secondary profile or something so someone knows what is acceptable to do to another player. Or just ask them. I know that sounds really lame, but you can just always ask where someones boundries are. Mail them or something beforehand. Say someone pissed off an evil warlock or something, then that player could mail the other and ask them what their boundries are. Again, just suggestions and all. I think the issue (the way I see it) is forcing something on another player is not OK, and some people handle some things better than others.

There is unfortunately not a one-size fits all solution to this problem.
_________________
Comments, Questions, and concerns?
Please reach out to me in in thee areas
Amorrison0410@gmail.com(slowest communication)
Ketamishadowmaul #7136 on Discord
Eris Asuna Discordia on Facebook Messenger.
Mail Eris on the mud
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
essyllis



Joined: 10 May 2014
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 6:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Trixy subject.

I believe in general that most here at grow people. And as a principble don't believe that grown people should be policed or told how to behave.

That being said. We are all grown individuals. With different definitions of whats fun, painful, embarrassing, boundaries and what is required before someone gets triggered.

Hence I choose to believe that none here are actively out to ruin the game for someone else. However I do believe that two individuals can go horrible wrong of each other because they are individuals with different past experiences and pains.

I believe that we still have the option to "Fade to Black". And this should at all times be respected!
If the Drow character have caught the Elf character, and starts pulling off his/her fingernails with rusty nails ... Because that what Drows like to do to elves. Then thats a situation that in my view is allowed and if both are fine to RP it out. Knock yourself out.

However, if the Elf character do not feel comfortable with such. Say/Emote 'Fade to black' And both players should then agree that for future Rp references. It should be said that the drow tutored the elf mercilessly.

Of course, the drow-player may not really feel up to the task of pulling fingernails just that day. and could therefore also call a 'fade to black' and again come to the RP agreement that horrible torture were performed.

I believe that if we can adhere to such rules. We can still have conflict filled situations where characters develop innate hatret to one another and start the wars that would be needed.


TL-DR: Respect the 'Fade to Black' rules and use it when needed. And we can still create conflict situations without neuter evil chars.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
Lujke
Immortal


Joined: 18 Nov 2006
Posts: 642

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

First let me state my position: As a person, I have a pretty liberal point of view. I am sex positive, LGBTQ friendly, kink positive and generally in favour of freedom of expression.

Also of note is that I don't know anything much about the recent situations that have provoked the discussion. If people have been hurt or triggered by it, I'm genuinely sorry to hear that.

That said, I'd like as few restrictions as possible on what people can RP. We've decided not to restrict people because they want to use SG in different ways. PL-ing is okay if that's what you want to do. I'd like to include dark theme RP as one of those things you can do if you want to, but don't have to if you don't like it.

I do quite like the idea of a series of OOC opt-ins that could be read in the finger information for a character. That way, we won't need to get confused about people's IC and OOC preferences.

Last note on mudsex: can we please stop shaming of mudsex? If you don't like it or don't do it, that's fine. If you can't see the point, that's fine too. Don't do it. If it makes you feel awkward that other people do it, you can leave the room or stop scrying or whatever.

I don't mean that as a particular endorsement. I'm just aware that it's a pastime that some people enjoy, and I don't see any particular harm in it to anyone else. I see shaming as a form of bullying, whatever the topic.

L

PS Don't anyone try to mudsex me on the basis of this post. That's not the point.
_________________
Bears don't dig on dancing
(They just don't dig it)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=78XrI_2bPVA&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvnYIxv_364&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RFO6ZhUW38w
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
essyllis



Joined: 10 May 2014
Posts: 92

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 8:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lujke wrote:

Last note on mudsex: can we please stop shaming of mudsex? If you don't like it or don't do it, that's fine. If you can't see the point, that's fine too. Don't do it. If it makes you feel awkward that other people do it, you can leave the room or stop scrying or whatever.
L

PS Don't anyone try to mudsex me on the basis of this post. That's not the point.


I actually believe it's the same discussion as with pørn. Some people think it's fine and are regular users of it. Some people deny it and are regular users it in secret. And some do get triggered. But I do agree.
If you don't like sexual contact on the mud, it should be pretty easy to stay clear of. If you are triggered by other people doing it .. You are wasting way to much energy on things that's not your business.
(Unless of course you'r a stiff-necked paladin of Tyr who binds all women characters in chastity belts. In that way ... All powa to ya!).

And do not pester Lujke ... You may end tasting my jealous side *wink wink*.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
saide
Immortal


Joined: 18 Mar 2007
Posts: 395

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 1:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I am very much with Lujke on being an open minded, kink positive, LGBTQ friendly, sex positive person. I am also very much in favor of freedom of expression, with very rare exceptions.

My issue is only that to me it seems like most of that stuff has no place on SG - we've added depth to the game where it doesn't need any - so we end up having players that require us (immortals) to simulate stuff constantly for them to have any fun.

We have players that are not okay just playing the game - they need constant attention beyond the code.

I know that we need some better tools to let players do more interactive things/interact better together without our intervention. One idea I had for this was to let players create their own plots with rewards - have the ability to invite people into those plots with an idea of what the plot would contain before hand - and those people could do the same - up to an x amount of people - it would need work definitely.

Now, with all that said - the torture/sex stuff on SG I really think falls into the category of depth that is not needed. I recognize that some people enjoy it/have enjoyed it and have somehow had amazing fun playing an amputee. I know others have not had the same fun.

As of yesterday it's up for a vote in game. Log in, vote the way that you see fit.

At the end of the day - depending on the votes - it's either going to go away OR it's going to be opt in - so you'll be opted out - and have to set up some type of profile verifying that you are 18 and okay with adult situations - and then provide some detail about what you are okay with.

Now, since I'm King and Commander of SG I expect that you will find me and give me a bunch of gold on SG and probably your best item, otherwise maybe I'll just go crazy Wink
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kassius
Site Admin


Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Everyone seems to want RP and that is fine, so I'm going to ask why the RP is so poor and while this might offend some of you, I'm being serious. If you want RP then why do we do the below things, because to be honest it isn't RP to log in and have a different rl name.

Drow that hang out with everyone
LG Players traveling with known evil
Constant OOC conversation and no respect for the storyline(Ie man could you add me more damage and ac bonuses)

That isn't RPing guys, whispering prevy shit about giving doses of medicine(ie cum) to your mudsex partner isn't flirting in a fantasy world, it is basically a chat.

Now whether you guys like this or not admin have an obligation to consider these things. I was 13 when I started and by 15 I'd been exposed to enough mudsex bullshit that had my parents found out they could have sued the shit out of Tristan and them. I know two admin IRL have met a third and I don't wish any of that for them. While the mud seems older, it isn't something we can determine and a damn yes or no isn't going to hold up in court, I'd almost guarantee that. However, whatever admin decides is fine, what bothers me is people want RP but refuse to actually do it. YEs yes I know RP is subjective, but Rp isn't subjective when you type score and it tells you your damn role.. So if you want RP fine, have it, just actually RP the role you rolled and quit trying to make it a free for all. When I purposed this I didn't actually think anyone would care, because no one seems to care when I'm not interacting with them, when I interact RP is really pretty decent, when I'm not it drops off a cliff and falling into a pit of OOC and item bonuses..


Now Mikyn, I have never been one to hide behind chat when speaking in chat. I did call you a cocksucker after you accused one of the Admin of cheating who is a RL friend and said inflammatory comments about him while also telling me I was a trash RPer, because I confronted you about your superior attitude and your "cornered" rage quitting, which you've done to about everyone on the mud from Trillet, Tuurghol to myself. If you can't handle the heat don't be a prick, which you tend to be to anyone who isn't NF, Aunwee, or Innaeli. We all conflict in opinion, hell I've got into arguments with Saide about some of his implications. I started Reylin to prove to him how broke dual wielding was after I told him for like 2 months IRL, but he has so many things going on. We all have said horrible things, done horrible things to each other. I don't dislike you, I actually enjoy chatting, hearing your opinion, or RPing with you most of the time. What I don't like is the fact that you do come across as superior and you can make others feel inferior with an unwillingness to help them be better, just want to bitch about them and you tend to REALLY not be able to handle any competition that you don't win. I've been the same in the past, but I think if anything Alzar taught me to enjoy losing. I loved RP with Azalon and Ramius they both had 15 levels on me. I knew my time would come when they didn't.. I didn't enjoy rp with certain Archmagi, because they didn't seem to understand the rules. My point is its hard to respect someone's opinion who always seems to have an elitist point of view, I know that because that was me 6 months to a year ago. Now I'm considering other points of view and they aren't so bad.

Kas
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Whisper



Joined: 27 Jun 2017
Posts: 17

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 2:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where to start on this can of worms? Alright first and foremost, if you knew Whisper you know what a black hearted dick he could be with torture rp. Truth be told I rarely dismembered anyone contrary to rumor, though I did brand, cut and torment to my hearts content, Do I regret it today, perhaps some of it because I can go overboard and that is a weakness I recognize. But I think this kind of rp should be allowed, we have fade to blade for those who would rather not see the details, but I think this should be up to the players involved. As to those who want to scry these events, again that is up to that player, they can always change the channel.

As to rape or sexual torture content rp, I have avoided that, but I can't remember if at one point I castrated Stefano for messing with my wife after repeated warnings, but even then I felt the rp justified.

As to mudsex, if you come to the mud for the purpose only I say you should leave. Mudsex should be allowed though, I have had few relationships in the game over my many years, but I felt when it happened is was adding depth to the personal rp between the two involved. Did I need it, no, if my partner had said they would like to fade to black and just have the intimacy as an off screen given I would have been cool with that too. I would appreciate it greatly to keep the methods of rp to the players.

Viola had a great idea where you have to answer if you are over 18, great idea to put into finger. Knowing if the player you are dealing with is not a minor would be a great comfort for all rp variations.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ViolaRose



Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kassius wrote:
While the mud seems older, it isn't something we can determine and a damn yes or no isn't going to hold up in court, I'd almost guarantee that.


I'm no lawyer and don't claim to be one on the forums, but this seems to work out okay for porn/booze sites. Just sayin. Very Happy
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Octothorpe
Immortal


Joined: 10 Jul 2008
Posts: 365
Location: below the 9 on your phone

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The longer I have been an imm, the more I respect and understand where Tristan was coming from 15 years ago. When Tristan realized that I was 15-16 years old when I was first playing on SG in 1999-2000, he shat himself and told me that I needed to have parental permission to play. "Uh huh, sure, lemme get right on that *asshole*." Saide mentioned to me the other day that Tristan had the same freak out with him for the same thing. Now, obviously we don't have any actionable way to verify anyone's age, and those age gate things are feckless. That said, this game is clearly for adults only and should have a disclaimer as such, even without the mudsex/rape RP.

Personally, I feel like if you would not feel comfortable RPing a situation in detail at a tabletop game in front of other players and the DM, you should not being RPing it here. With that said, I bet a lot of people would say that they totally RP going balls deep with a fellow player in a RL tabletop game, sick bastards =P. If people want to have the freedom to RP that way, then I feel that they also need to accept responsibilities for the consequences of that RP. To me, the game is about being an adventurer and committing mass murder of monsters to obtain treasure. To others, it is more about RP and simulating RL relationships in a virtual space. I have no problems for that, but such RP can cause RL pain and discomfort to others. I would hate for the game to be forced to shut down due to some sort of backlash from a real or imagined sexual harassment incident. I feel as time goes on, there is a real risk of this happening.

I don't know what the solution is. Do we prevent such RP from occurring at all? Do we have it be opt-in by those that choose to participate in it? Do we need to have actual waivers signed and submitted by those that want to participate?
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message Send e-mail
ViolaRose



Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

saide wrote:
We have players that are not okay just playing the game - they need constant attention beyond the code.


This really just provides the context as to why it's so important that we're able to mess with other players to the degree of binding/robbing/burning/etc. Players ARE the living, ever-changing elements on Shadowgate. Thus it makes them prime ways to get the point across that HEY I'M EVIL LOOKIT WHAT I DID, which requires absolutely no intervention from avatars.

Compared with, say an evil character wanted to kidnap the local princess and lock her in a tower guarded by demogorgons. Can't do it without avatar interaction. Even blackmail plots are next to impossible in our environment, and they'd be even less so if we couldn't put out the threat of bodily harm.

So your true argument is that the game really doesn't need evil beyond the NPC mobs you've given us which, frankly, is terribly untrue. These are not interactive to the degree a story's villain should be. And those of us who value roleplay on shadowgate, value the immersiveness of a good story being told, even if it means we're going to be out an eyeball until someone can fix it.

Now, that said, currently as it stands anyone whom is injured in a plot is expected to roleplay those injuries for two weeks as sort of a 'to the victor goes the spoils' type thing. I'd definitely not mind seeing that time cut down to as long as it takes the person to find help and get healed. The storyline would remain in tact and nobody has to be without their tongue for an overly long period of time.

And for good measure I'll just throw on here that beyond the hefty task of giving players the power to run plots, give out rewards, etc., something as simple as giving the players the ability to create graffiti would open up many possible story lines, and it might not be too terribly disagreeable to code since the ability already exists for avatars. But just a thought, and a bit out of context perhaps, but I see this whole thread has begun its downward spiral into wtf just happened..
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kassius
Site Admin


Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Viola,

Did you even read Octo's post? This has nothing to do with yall's preconceived need for a storyline. I love story lines and you know me well enough to know that I fought hard for us to stay RP enforced. However, about a year ago, maybe 6 months it dawned on me all the shit I'd seen from something I read online and how a game was being held accountable for some fucked up shit with kids. I talked to Saide and they had been discussing this already.

Read Octo's point, we have RL people who would be held accountable and you're worried about your story? I expect more out of you. Saide, Ares, Nienne, and Octo are the games Admin and I can bet my life that if this games becomes an issue for them they'd rather shut it down, rather than fight for it. You all can say well thats never happened. No shit it hasn't happened, yet, but we only need one psycho person to ignite this powder keg.

Kas
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ViolaRose



Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, no. I'd not read it because he posted it the same time I was posting what I posted (my response was to Saide as you can see by the quote I ..er, quoted), but it doesn't really change my opinion.

You can expect more from me all you want, but I'm pretty sure Shadowgate didn't invent violence, and while it might perpetuate it, it's far from alone in that. I mean, if there's legal issues and concerns, then just shut down the MuD. D&D causes kids to go crazy and worship satan and kill their parents, after all, right? Shut down all hundreds of games and muds and mushes who deal with the same issues, in similar settings.

Shut down every sex chatroom in the world, but perhaps shut down the ones that deal with bdsm and kink stuff first, because you know that's some sinful shit happening there. Likely to people far younger than our playerbase tends to be.

Or don't, because whether ShadowGate exists or not, the same stuff is happening in every other corner of the internet, from Tumblr to...honestly, I don't even know where kids put their cyber dick these days, but it's mostly likely in the in-box of some unsuspecting teenage girl who has already seen a dozen dick pics that day. Is there any kid who hasn't logged into a porn site by the time they've hit puberty these days? I doubt it. But right, sex on ShadowGate is the problem.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
kassius
Site Admin


Joined: 17 Aug 2017
Posts: 243

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 10:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Viola,

We have zero control over any of those other aspects and I'm not focused on ANY of those. I'm focused on SG. You can make excuses, because you want your game to stay the way you want it. You aren't the person in charge and because of that you most likely have NO reason to worry. The 4 admin have plenty of reason to be concerned. There are college courses now being taught about harassment in online video games... It is a bigger deal than when I start 15+ years ago or whatever it was..1998 or something like that.

Sorry I expected more, I won't anymore.

Kas
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
ViolaRose



Joined: 20 Apr 2015
Posts: 113

PostPosted: Mon Nov 27, 2017 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, like I said, I'm not a lawyer and I don't pretend to be. Also like I said, if it's a problem shut it down.

My point is that somehow everything else in the whole world seems to be getting away with similar content, so can't we figure out how they go about it?

Some sort of proper disclaimer that says the admins take no responsibility for what happens on the game and will not be held accountable for pervy creeps doing nasty things, perhaps? Another disclaimer saying you verify you're of age to be exposed to adult content? A "play at your own risk" clause??

I honestly don't know, but it seems like websites far more large and popular (i.e. every dating app ever) than ShadowGate have figured out how to protect themselves from accountability in the unlikely case of something like the aforementioned situation occurring.
Back to top
View user's profile Send private message
Display posts from previous:   
Post new topic   This topic is locked: you cannot edit posts or make replies.    Shadowgate Forum Index -> General discussion All times are GMT
Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3  Next
Page 2 of 3

 
Jump to:  
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum


Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group. Hosted by phpBB.BizHat.com